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Breather and PCV discussion

This is a discussion on Breather and PCV discussion within the Veloster Performance forums, part of the Veloster Turbo Garage category; Originally Posted by Veloturbo Breather side of course!!! The pcv side however i personally would NOT. The pcv system works under vaccuum which is MOST ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Veloturbo View Post
    Breather side of course!!! The pcv side however i personally would NOT. The pcv system works under vaccuum which is MOST of my driving, especially long freeway haulls. It helps lower wear on rings and helps keep oil cleaner. If it was a track or race car id be all over it. Not on a daily. Its just one of those iffy things that the performance/benefits are null and the downsides are potentially worse. Im excited to see how it works out
    With the oem setup it just keeps vapor filled air moving through the valve cover at all times and returning it to the motor air stream to be used again plus gunk everything up which can eventually lead to lspi events. At no time will it create any vacuum in the valve cover for any performance benefit. Purely for emissions.

    Under boost conditions you have X amount of air from blow by trying to be forced out of the 3/8" breather. This creates positive pressure in the valve cover which hurts power and efficiency. With my setup having two 3/8" breathers, regardless of in boost of vacuum the pressure will not build up in the valve cover like the oem setup has due to 2x flow potential. So there is actually clear benefit to that under boost conditions.

    Now hook those lines to a pan evac or vacuum pump setup and more significant power/efficiency can be gained. Generally along the lines of +2-4% on average. More possibly if the motor has a ton of blow by.

    This type of mod will never let dirty air back into your engine to gunk things up and cause lspi, will increase power/efficiency in VTA form, and more so when using a pan evac or vacuum pump setup. Best of both worlds type mod IMO and would benefit anyone. Likely an essential mod for anyone if they choose to get cans or not.....
    Last edited by trdtoy; 08-21-2017 at 07:44 PM.
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    who won the debate?
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    So when's the DIY guide coming out?
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    JD do you ever see me around town, i never see anyone but a yellow NA and a black NA.
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    Quote Originally Posted by E9C900A View Post
    The valve cover is not partitioned to separate breather from PCVV, as I mentioned in the other thread with the picture I took, otherwise there would be walls with more gaskets.

    The open area where the D-CVVT rotors are located should give enough of a clue to indicate that the whole valve cover is shared. There are neither marks nor carbon deposits on the underside of the valve cover to give a hint as to a sealed partition contacting it.
    The valve cover is separated all the way up to the point of the rotors by the gaskets that go down the middle around the spark plugs openings. That is enough separation to create the vacuum needed to feed the PCV side without just drawing air directly from the breather port. Suggesting that the PCV just draws air from the breather is silly and shows and misunderstanding on how the system works. As can be seen in the picture below. There is quite a bit of separation between each side and the end were the chain (rotor) is located is quite full so it's not this big open chasm as suggested by the valve cover that just free flows air. There are also separate ports coming up from the CC on each side of the valve area that also allow each side to receive gasses from the CC up through the valve cover area.

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    2016 VT-DCT, Tech PKG (Destroyed in Wreck)
    TUNED HP/TQ: 224/258(Mustang) 242/279(Dynojet)
    Performance:SXTH 3.5" CAI, SXTH PCV OCC, Mishimoto Breather OCC, Coolant Bypass, CAT delete, Uniq Perf Strut bar, Pierce Torsion Bar, ORHP, BOV and Tork Boost Control Solenoid, HKS M40XL Plugs, 845MS Cold Pipe with HKS SSQV4, 845MS HI-FLO Catted DP Lights:DD HID 5K low beams, DD Turn as Tail, modified reverse lights, Brake light pulser, DD LED Throughout, LaminX yellow fogs

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    Quote Originally Posted by trdtoy View Post
    Glad I could explain it so you understand what I was saying.

    The flow out of the cover via breather will be the same as the amount of blow by the motor produces. And yes, more will come out suddenly after sudden drop from boost to vac from the sudden pressure differential change.

    The efficiency differences and oil dilution is not going to be anything you'll notice on a VTA setup and be much improved on a vac sourced setup. And what happens in the CC has nothing to do with the oil that's important to the motor.....
    Yeah, you didn't explain it so I could understand, you corrected it to match what I was saying. Good move
    2016 VT-DCT, Tech PKG (Destroyed in Wreck)
    TUNED HP/TQ: 224/258(Mustang) 242/279(Dynojet)
    Performance:SXTH 3.5" CAI, SXTH PCV OCC, Mishimoto Breather OCC, Coolant Bypass, CAT delete, Uniq Perf Strut bar, Pierce Torsion Bar, ORHP, BOV and Tork Boost Control Solenoid, HKS M40XL Plugs, 845MS Cold Pipe with HKS SSQV4, 845MS HI-FLO Catted DP Lights:DD HID 5K low beams, DD Turn as Tail, modified reverse lights, Brake light pulser, DD LED Throughout, LaminX yellow fogs

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    Quote Originally Posted by trdtoy View Post
    With the oem setup it just keeps vapor filled air moving through the valve cover at all times and returning it to the motor air stream to be used again plus gunk everything up which can eventually lead to lspi events. At no time will it create any vacuum in the valve cover for any performance benefit. Purely for emissions.

    Under boost conditions you have X amount of air from blow by trying to be forced out of the 3/8" breather. This creates positive pressure in the valve cover which hurts power and efficiency. With my setup having two 3/8" breathers, regardless of in boost of vacuum the pressure will not build up in the valve cover like the oem setup has due to 2x flow potential. So there is actually clear benefit to that under boost conditions.

    Now hook those lines to a pan evac or vacuum pump setup and more significant power/efficiency can be gained. Generally along the lines of +2-4% on average. More possibly if the motor has a ton of blow by.

    This type of mod will never let dirty air back into your engine to gunk things up and cause lspi, will increase power/efficiency in VTA form, and more so when using a pan evac or vacuum pump setup. Best of both worlds type mod IMO and would benefit anyone. Likely an essential mod for anyone if they choose to get cans or not.....
    Ok, so with this set up I think I agree. Your saying you're basically converting the PCV side into a breather that's assisted by a vacuum pump? Do I have that right?

    Venting the PCV to air I don't agree with because you loose the vacuum assist to help evacuate those gasses but if I'm reading what you're saying right it sounds good.
    2016 VT-DCT, Tech PKG (Destroyed in Wreck)
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    Performance:SXTH 3.5" CAI, SXTH PCV OCC, Mishimoto Breather OCC, Coolant Bypass, CAT delete, Uniq Perf Strut bar, Pierce Torsion Bar, ORHP, BOV and Tork Boost Control Solenoid, HKS M40XL Plugs, 845MS Cold Pipe with HKS SSQV4, 845MS HI-FLO Catted DP Lights:DD HID 5K low beams, DD Turn as Tail, modified reverse lights, Brake light pulser, DD LED Throughout, LaminX yellow fogs

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    Quote Originally Posted by leesrt View Post
    The valve cover is separated all the way up to the point of the rotors by the gaskets that go down the middle around the spark plugs openings. That is enough separation to create the vacuum needed to feed the PCV side without just drawing air directly from the breather port. Suggesting that the PCV just draws air from the breather is silly and shows and misunderstanding on how the system works. As can be seen in the picture below. There is quite a bit of separation between each side and the end were the chain (rotor) is located is quite full so it's not this big open chasm as suggested by the valve cover that just free flows air. There are also separate ports coming up from the CC on each side of the valve area that also allow each side to receive gasses from the CC up through the valve cover area.
    Have you actually taken the valve cover off?

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    Quote Originally Posted by E9C900A View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by leesrt View Post
    The valve cover is separated all the way up to the point of the rotors by the gaskets that go down the middle around the spark plugs openings. That is enough separation to create the vacuum needed to feed the PCV side without just drawing air directly from the breather port. Suggesting that the PCV just draws air from the breather is silly and shows and misunderstanding on how the system works. As can be seen in the picture below. There is quite a bit of separation between each side and the end were the chain (rotor) is located is quite full so it's not this big open chasm as suggested by the valve cover that just free flows air. There are also separate ports coming up from the CC on each side of the valve area that also allow each side to receive gasses from the CC up through the valve cover area.
    Have you actually taken the valve cover off?
    No, not on this car but I have seen enough photos from every angle to understand what's going on and I have seen plenty of engines with their valve covers removed so it's not a foreign topic for me. Is there something I stated about how things are working under the valve cover that is wrong?

    Valve covers aren't complicated things, it's quite easy to see how it's designed and why.
    2016 VT-DCT, Tech PKG (Destroyed in Wreck)
    TUNED HP/TQ: 224/258(Mustang) 242/279(Dynojet)
    Performance:SXTH 3.5" CAI, SXTH PCV OCC, Mishimoto Breather OCC, Coolant Bypass, CAT delete, Uniq Perf Strut bar, Pierce Torsion Bar, ORHP, BOV and Tork Boost Control Solenoid, HKS M40XL Plugs, 845MS Cold Pipe with HKS SSQV4, 845MS HI-FLO Catted DP Lights:DD HID 5K low beams, DD Turn as Tail, modified reverse lights, Brake light pulser, DD LED Throughout, LaminX yellow fogs

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    Quote Originally Posted by trdtoy View Post
    Now hook those lines to a pan evac or vacuum pump setup and more significant power/efficiency can be gained. Generally along the lines of +2-4% on average. More possibly if the motor has a ton of blow by.
    The engine is a vaccuum pump, and the pcv only works under vaccuum. Im not trying to tell you your wrong per say, i just dont think its worth it for obvious reasons. Why did everyone for all these years waste money on catch cans if all they had to do was put a breather filter on?
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