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Discussion Starter #1
Sorry if this has been answered, which it probably has, but this search engine doesn't recognize certain words for me. Anyhow I have a 16 DCT with mods listed below and I am thinking of purchasing the AEM meth kit but Im curious as to risks and maintaining/troubleshooting. Any input from people with the kit or just people with knowledge is much appreciated. Thanks!
 

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adding an WAI (Water/Alcohol Injection) kit absolutely creates additional maintenance. Aside from ensuring you keep the tank full, you'll need to make sure the lines stay in good shape, the nozzle stays clean. I'd recommend a solenoid. The trouble with the solenoids is that they are problematic as hell, but a necessary evil if you are injecting AFTER the throttle body. The car will draw meth from the line at vacuum otherwise. If you have the means, I highly recommend using NPT fittings and lines instead of the push lock setup. This is more important if you are running pure METH. If you are using a watered down version.... less important.

Most anti-WAI folks ramble on and on about the dangers of having alcohol in a tank in the car... nevermind the fact that you have 13 gallons of BOOM BOOM juice in the rear end of the car at any given time. So fuck that, bunch of unfounded bullshit.

What type of mixture are you planning on running and what are your intentions for the meth?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I plan on running a 50/50 mixture. Even though I’ve read that it’s a rip off and that I can mix it, I’ll probably run Boost Juice just for piece of mind. I’m a weirdo and would spaz mixing anything so premade works more for me. I want it so that my internals stay clean and cool, hp gains would be a plus too. I’m not tuned atm, plan on a SXTH tune in the months to come but I don’t think I want to tune for meth from what I’ve read.
 

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you're over thinking this tho... you should read about WAI injection in other places than just the Veloster Community too my man, LOTS of false dogma floating around.

1st - this isn't exact science chemistry. If you have a local source for pure meth on pump you can probably score 5 gallons at a time for 2 to 3 bucks a gallon. give that a half/half cut with water and your good to go. if the solution isn't exact, youll be fine. The purity of Boost Juice is highly questionable. That said, I buy pure meth 70% cheaper than a gallon of boost juice... it is, flat out, a rip off. If you aren't tuning for the stuff and just want is to keep things cooler and cleaner, just run blue -20 windshield wiper fluid. Stuff is water and methanol with blue dye. Boost Juice is water and methanol with red die (albeit, a bit more meth)

2nd - you wont see power gains without a tune, and wont see power gains with 50/50 mix

3rd - the fear of tuning for meth is a little misguided. You tune for meth, then run meth. The issue comes up if/when you run out of meth while driving. However, I see almost NO case where you would run out and not know (you should be monitoring if you are running meth) at which point you just stay off the throttle and keep the boost low and you have no issues. I'm tuned, run 100% M, and I've had a solenoid failure which meant no spray... I just eased off the throttle until I could get it fixed (took 36 hours).

In summary - Try to separate the fear mongering from the info. In simplest terms, if you want to run WAI on your car, it adds a level of complexity to your maintenance, driving, and care that you need to accept. When you understand what WAI is, what makes it good, bad, and otherwise... you have no issues.

WAI is like owning a firearm... nothing unsafe about owning, carrying, or shooting a firearm... what makes them unsafe is not knowing how to properly use and care for them and not respecting them.
 

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***Adding WAI is a plus if setup correctly but will hurt power and can be dangerous if not setup correctly.***

Setup CORRECTLY you can see GAINS in mpg and power regardless of the mix used as well as significant iat and egt reduction. Setup INCORRECTLY you can still have iat and egt reduction as well along with LESS power. Also risk for engine damage is possible.

***The thing to pay attention to the most is the amount of WATER being injected as this will kill power moreso than too much meth being injected. The smallest nozzle that comes with the AEM kit(250 cc/min or 4 GPH) is too big to run a 50/50 mix and see all the benefits of WAI on the VT. This means a smaller nozzle must be used and the aggressiveness of the spray must be ramped back on the controller.***

Most inject post TB into a ported spacer which is fine. I'd also suggest a small nozzle near the turbo in the hot pipe for further temperature reduction and less heat soak of components. If you do this and use higher than a 50% mix of meth I'd for sure have the BOV recirculate to the intake or to fresh air away from heat.

One step further to see more gains is getting boost source for the controller directly off the turbo instead of from the manifold. This will allow spray to start in vacuum instead of low boost areas so gains would be seen during light throttle such as city driving or highway/interstate driving where the normal hookup method off the manifold would not normally spray.

Use a filter, check valve, and solenoid if you can. The filter will keep the nozzle/s cleaner and spraying better. The check valve and solenoid will help keep vac/boost/gravity from messing with fluid flow in/out the nozzle/s.

Use distilled water and/or methanol only. Nothing with dye in it unless you have to. The dye will cause buildup over time and more maintenance and potential issues.

If running over 50% meth mix use leak free fittings instead of the nylon push lock setup. Also be sure tank is not near a heat source and vented to fresh air away from a heat source. Fire risk is real and meth burning is very difficult to see.

When hooking up the controller to a power source I'd also add in an on/off toggle switch to be able to turn it off at any given time.

Maintenance wise you need to check for leaks, nozzle spray and cleanliness, clean filters in the line and at nozzle/s, and check for proper function of check valve, solenoid, and controller.

Using WAI in addendum to an already safe tune is the safest way to go. You will not have as much power as if tuned specifically for WAI but also less worries about messing the engine up. 7-10% power gains are not unheard of doing it this way. More can be had if tuned for it but come with the risks of engine damage if the system does not inject properly for whatever reason.
 

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I agree with most of what's said here.
A few things to think about though.

You don't need to buy a complete kit.
I have pieced mine together from components from AEM, Snow, and other misc. stuff. (AEM filter, pump & control, Snow Solenoid & nozzle)
The only suggestion if going this route is use the same brand pump and controller.
I can't say for sure if there'd be differences (probably not), but it made set up easier.

Ty is right about a lot of misinformation. If you read things anywhere about it causing corrosion in engines, it's not necessarily wrong, it's just not reasonable.
It will take a very long time for any notable corrosion to occur (with a 50/50 mix). Carbon will build up a lot quicker.

There are two main reasons for WAI (relating to power only).
1) It will decrease the temperature of the air which results in more dense air. More air = More fuel = More Power
This doesn't really require tuning.
2) The part that requires tuning is more related to the other item. It suppresses detonation, effectively raising the octane of the fuel.
So if you're using pump 91/93 and a 50/50 WAI mix, you'll essentially be running on race fuel, and can tune to this.

As for the mixture itself, Ty is 100% correct. If it's 49% or 51% it doesn't really matter, but trdtoy made a good point about using distilled water only.
I disagree with others about running above a 50/50. There are SAE published papers detailing that performance may begin to drop after a 50/50 mix.
While methanol is less volatile than gasoline, and has a high 'octane', its energy density is significantly less than that of gas.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Wow, tons of information!! Thanks guys I really appreciate it! It seems that I have a few things to consider still, I will be holding off for awhile but I will definitely let everyone know when and what I decide on.
 

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If you have the means, I highly recommend using NPT fittings and lines instead of the push lock setup. This is more important if you are running pure METH. If you are using a watered down version.... less important.

Most anti-WAI folks ramble on and on about the dangers of having alcohol in a tank in the car... nevermind the fact that you have 13 gallons of BOOM BOOM juice in the rear end of the car at any given time. So fuck that, bunch of unfounded bullshit.
Any meth mix that's flammable, not just pure, should not use push-loc fittings, and should not have the tank mounted in the cabin unless vented to fresh air away from heat or the fire risk increases in both cases.

Gas in the fuel tank is not vented to atmosphere or near potential heat source to cause a fire like a meth tank in the cabin could be.
 

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I plan on running a 50/50 mixture. Even though I’ve read that it’s a rip off and that I can mix it, I’ll probably run Boost Juice just for piece of mind. I’m a weirdo and would spaz mixing anything so premade works more for me. I want it so that my internals stay clean and cool, hp gains would be a plus too. I’m not tuned atm, plan on a SXTH tune in the months to come but I don’t think I want to tune for meth from what I’ve read.
Not sure where you're located or how you plan to get the tune but SXTH no longer does remote tunes just FYI. They only do tunes in person or sell lap 3 tunes now.
 

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you're over thinking this tho... you should read about WAI injection in other places than just the Veloster Community too my man, LOTS of false dogma floating around.

1st - this isn't exact science chemistry. If you have a local source for pure meth on pump you can probably score 5 gallons at a time for 2 to 3 bucks a gallon. give that a half/half cut with water and your good to go. if the solution isn't exact, youll be fine. The purity of Boost Juice is highly questionable. That said, I buy pure meth 70% cheaper than a gallon of boost juice... it is, flat out, a rip off. If you aren't tuning for the stuff and just want is to keep things cooler and cleaner, just run blue -20 windshield wiper fluid. Stuff is water and methanol with blue dye. Boost Juice is water and methanol with red die (albeit, a bit more meth)

2nd - you wont see power gains without a tune, and wont see power gains with 50/50 mix

3rd - the fear of tuning for meth is a little misguided. You tune for meth, then run meth. The issue comes up if/when you run out of meth while driving. However, I see almost NO case where you would run out and not know (you should be monitoring if you are running meth) at which point you just stay off the throttle and keep the boost low and you have no issues. I'm tuned, run 100% M, and I've had a solenoid failure which meant no spray... I just eased off the throttle until I could get it fixed (took 36 hours).

In summary - Try to separate the fear mongering from the info. In simplest terms, if you want to run WAI on your car, it adds a level of complexity to your maintenance, driving, and care that you need to accept. When you understand what WAI is, what makes it good, bad, and otherwise... you have no issues.

WAI is like owning a firearm... nothing unsafe about owning, carrying, or shooting a firearm... what makes them unsafe is not knowing how to properly use and care for them and not respecting them.
Never run anything with dye unless you have to. It causes buildup in the system and the engine.

You can see power gains without a tune and with a 50/50 mix. You just have to setup properly.

Tuned for meth can be dangerous as it only takes one hiccup of the system having no or low spray for the engine to pop before signs of malfunction could be caught. Really depends on how the tune is setup though.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Not sure where you're located or how you plan to get the tune but SXTH no longer does remote tunes just FYI. They only do tunes in person or sell lap 3 tunes now.
In PA and moving to FL in the months to come. I was planing on getting tuned as I pass through SC.
 

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I agree with most of what's said here.
A few things to think about though.

You don't need to buy a complete kit.
I have pieced mine together from components from AEM, Snow, and other misc. stuff. (AEM filter, pump & control, Snow Solenoid & nozzle)
The only suggestion if going this route is use the same brand pump and controller.
I can't say for sure if there'd be differences (probably not), but it made set up easier.

Ty is right about a lot of misinformation. If you read things anywhere about it causing corrosion in engines, it's not necessarily wrong, it's just not reasonable.
It will take a very long time for any notable corrosion to occur (with a 50/50 mix). Carbon will build up a lot quicker.

There are two main reasons for WAI (relating to power only).
1) It will decrease the temperature of the air which results in more dense air. More air = More fuel = More Power
This doesn't really require tuning.
2) The part that requires tuning is more related to the other item. It suppresses detonation, effectively raising the octane of the fuel.
So if you're using pump 91/93 and a 50/50 WAI mix, you'll essentially be running on race fuel, and can tune to this.

As for the mixture itself, Ty is 100% correct. If it's 49% or 51% it doesn't really matter, but trdtoy made a good point about using distilled water only.
I disagree with others about running above a 50/50. There are SAE published papers detailing that performance may begin to drop after a 50/50 mix.
While methanol is less volatile than gasoline, and has a high 'octane', its energy density is significantly less than that of gas.
What determines power gains with a certain mix depends on if the tune is setup for that mix. Meth having less energy per unit than gas does not mean much here unless talking about a poorly setup kit and tune. Like saying E85 will make less power than 93 for the same reasons.....
 

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#popcorn

Just threw a 2-port TB spacer on the VN.

Debating whether or not I’ll save for the vaunted HFS4-v3.1 or just throw my Snow S1 in and let the JB4 do PWM control.

#preparations
 

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What determines power gains with a certain mix depends on if the tune is setup for that mix. Meth having less energy per unit than gas does not mean much here unless talking about a poorly setup kit and tune. Like saying E85 will make less power than 93 for the same reasons.....
Valid point. I'd honestly have to go back and look at the papers to see how old they were (Official SAE documents can be way out of date, see how official MPGs are determined for an example). If I recall I think it was old enough so that the engine did not employ GDI.
So good point trdtoy, if tuned very well, it might be to a power benefit.
 
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